I’ve seen this “good men do it” marketing before but never from a urologist (which is only clear at the bottom of the page).
★★☆☆☆ – Omits chronic pain risk while discussing risks of vasectomy
Pretty cringe-worthy article.
Does this guy throw out his conscious out with the water? What rubbish. First of all, what a silly ritual. Second, he knew very well what the risks were, but is unwilling to be honest in this article or with the men he butchers.
Are there risks? Of course: he might sneeze and chop something off or there might be a random infection, the normal stuff. Oh wait, what about Post Vasectomy Pain Syndromes (PVPS)? He fails to mention there’s also a 1-10% chance, depending on the source, of chronic pain and disfunction that is unpleasant at best and lift ruining at worst. He can’t even plead the still disingenuous ignorance of an general surgeon; he is a urologist! He knows the risks!
His man has betrayed his oath by failing to give patients full disclosure of the risks prior to surgery. He denies them the opportunity to make an informed decision.
I was reading about this on Reddit earlier today, and I felt like I was reading some sort of sickos vasectomy poetry.
No doubt there is a degree of cognitive dissonance at play here. He knows what a vasectomy does and what the risks are but prefers to pretend that the risks don’t exist.
OMG this is obscene, are they running that low on funds or are they wanting their new Mercedes. They have no conscience. It’s like they are playing with men’s mind’s making a career out of a guilt trip don’t get sucked in men I was and regret it every day.
It is noble for a man to make a sacrifice for their family, but how much good does it do one’s family when he cannot work, play, or have a healthy sexual relationship his wife?
Sure, most get lucky, but to fail to mention the risks as if they don’t exist should be criminal. It’s certantly highly unethical, when at bottom it is elective.
If a couple insists on rolling the dice on a sergical sterilization, good on him for taking one for the team; but, I know at least in my case, my family didn’t need my wife or I to get aergically sterilized. We never would have signed up for this if we knew there were long term risks. I thought I might have some ball pain for a few days or weeks; never had any suspicion that it could be for life. I suspect that a lot less men would do this if they were honestly counseled on the risks.
The good men project is a weird place, where the assumed condition seems that men are out to do bad, we are all terrible people and any interest in our own welfare or happiness is some dreadful selfish act.
Strangely enough they endlessly cheerlead for vasectomy despite the documented risks, and rarely call them out.
The world vasectomy day guy J Stack was a huge poster not sure if he is now, I noticed a lot of his articles were commented on with medical body supplied chronic pain risk information to counterpoint the standard ‘you are teh bad menz if no snipped’ narrative.
Actually it’s must almost be ‘world vasectomy day’ again soon, expect a crop of these articles without risk information over the next few weeks… Around that time I scan the web myself for when those pop up and add the peer reviewed risk information from urology and medical bodies in the comments so men may have a chance to be a little better informed. A good source for reference if anyone else likes joining with that that idea is : Https://www.reddit.com/r/postvasectomypain
On occasion I have also emailed the publication with those references and asked for the risks to be called out in line with the guidance of multiple urology bodies.
It’s a really small act but anyone considering a medical procedure really deserves the best peer reviewed risk data to be presented in making their decision, not glossed over or omitted completely.
Agreed, our impact is bound to be limited but collectively we can make a lot of noise. I think it is worth making it a personal challenge to never pass up an opportunity to give a little feedback on the issue. If it’s an article, make a comment; if a friend is thinking about doing it, if it is a coworker, or a friend of a friend, speak up. It’s the least we can do. Call the office that did this to you. Push the cognitive dissonance of their staff toward the critical mass at which they have to face it.
PVPS awareness is a meme and we just need to find the right way to increase its rate of replication; when someone brings up vasectomy, we need there to be a higher probability of someone knowing and mentioning the risk of pvps. If someone knows about it and gambles, so be it, but it is a tragity for someone to have this happen due to ignorance of the risks.
From what I’ve read vasectomy is down. This may or may not have anything to do with an increasing awareness of pvps but in any case the more we push back the better chance of at least getting them to acknowledge the risks of not put more effort into finding a solution. At the very least we may talk a few people out of it that otherwise might have ended up with pvps.
I’m not thinking he is pretending. The most disturbing part of the article to me was that it was written by a urologist, and equal to that - no mention of the potential risks and side effects - especially the ones that involve long term - ongoing pain. He claimed to be scared beforehand - but omitted disclosing what he was likely afraid of, and glossed it over by taking everyone’s eye off the ball.
If articals like Jonathan Brajtbord wrote don’t tell you all what kind of screwed up system we live in - I’m not sure what it would take.
Jonathan Brajtbord is definitely a shill of sorts. He’s also clearly a part of the “vasectomy is the man’s duty” meme.
Yes, I think their are two main memes in regard to vasectomy that are appealing: 1. It is a mans duty and/or taking one for the team, as it is less invasive than a sergical sterilization of a woman. 2. It’s safe and removes risk of pregnancy; it’s easy, free, effective, safe birth control.
I was taken in by booths of these. The meme we need to replicate is the counter meme to number 2: that it is not safe and not worth the risk as a means of sexual liberation.
If given the choice between a husband or wife being surgically sterilized, meme 1 seems to hold up, presuming the statistics in realities safety are true; however, resorting to sergical sterilization should be viewed of as a last resort given the risks involved to men and women alike; it should not be viewed as an alternative to condums.
The meme we need to spread (replicate) is that it is not a good idea for healthy men to get a vasectomy just because they won’t want another baby or don’t want to use condoms; in some cases men will still decide to get one but they need to do so after being properly advised of the risks. The person with this meme feel a pressure to speak out anytime vasectomy is brought up: “I heard it’s not safe and 1-2% of men end up with pvps.” This idea/meme will stick in the other persons mind and replicate with out people. A critical mass will be reached when pvps approaches a common knowledge.
As I’ve pointed out on this forum many times…
My android device is also part of a vasectomy meme as well. When I type vasectomy into my keyboard, the next suggested word is -safe- “vasectomy safe”.
At minimum - Android, Google, and CO, are involved in the meme too. Those entities are clearly pushing the “vasectomy safe” meme, and Jonathan Brajtbord is not far behind them.
This is important and I think I’ve mentioned it elsewhere as well: google results are not simply what is most often searched, but also what is programmed to appear first is the results. There have been articles on how google is trying to fight fake news / climate change denial / antivax websites by dilebertly pushing certain results “down” in the displayed results. This lowers the likelihood of people seeing what google doesn’t want them to see but also gives a false impression of popular thought.
It’s hard to know whether or not the results for various vasectomy related searches are deliberatly supressing knowledge of pvps in an effort to promote vasectomy for (chose your ulterior motive) but it’s not hard to consider that it is a possibility.
Yep, I’m well of all of that too.
A couple other reasons I think spreading the word is worthwhile, besides being disgusted by the causal and predatory way urologists are willing to risk men’s health without making an adequate effort to warn them:
- It might be the case that there are safety improvements that could happen if people put the effort in. Maybe some vasectomy techniques are safer than others. Maybe Vasalgel is safer. We need the data. In fact, if Vasalgel is safe, and gets deployed, I think the number of men getting sterilized would increase, which would be a net reduction on the burden women carry.
- Some people don’t have much upside to getting sterilized. Maybe they don’t have sex that much. Maybe menopause is right around the corner. Maybe Nexplanon or IUD is well tolerated. They deserve an accurate picture so that people who judge PVPS to be not worth the risk can make the correct decision for them. It is not appropriate for the urologist to pre-decide on their behalf and then put their thumb on the scale to make it happen.
- Men who end up with PVPS should get full support and right now they do not. Reversals for PVPS should be covered by insurance. Men should be taken seriously, have their complaints logged, get treated according to an honest to goodness protocol that is tested and evidence based.
- Women need to know about this. Not just from their suffering partner. They need to hear it from the culture too. Right now they just hear that vasectomy is no big deal. They need messaging from society that lets them view their partner as having been injured in the line of duty. They need to understand that he is not a wimp or delusional for wanting a reversal.
I couldn’t agree with you more on all of that Ethan, but the opposition is way beyond our control.
IMHO, the information contained in the thread below is absolutely not a coincidence either. Decades have passed away, and countess men and their families have had their lives flipped upside down and/or ruined over this stuff.
What’s the hold up?
Foxes watching the hen house, as you know.
Guy comes in with epididymitis. Had a vasectomy last year. Who decides whether that is relevant or a mere coincidence? The guy selling vasectomies decides.
That’s way to simple of an answer for me, and countless others.
To each their own reasoning I suppose.
There is more going on, sure. But this is a part.
If hospitals stayed in the black by selling cigarettes, I think that would have slowed down our science on lung cancer too.
Do people just randomly get epididimitus without a STI? Seems like that should be easy to connect the dots of a vasectomy is the only other preexisting factor unless one is making an effort not to. At leasr it should be easy to state that it is most likely the cause I would think.