Most of us have read the material where there is a link to autoimmune conditions that fire up after vasectomy. Then of course we read the phrases on pro vasectomy sites and they point blank put on there it does not cause ms, artheosclorosis etc.
I’m still really stumped about the leg, thigh,pain I have.Some of us have come right out and said MS like symptoms Arthritic stuff also. Lots of fellas here deal with it also. I stumbled across this and just thought it was interesting that most cases of MS in men occur when their testosterone levels drop. Heres the link… The testosterone thing is down near bottom. Hormonal changes.
When they remove the epididymis of men with PVPS and analyse it they rarely find infection but find Wallerian nerve degeneration. Find that to be strange as that’s what is happening in the spinal cord in people with MS. It’s a round about link but it’s definitely there. I wonder if there is a tolerable MS treatment that would help us. Other than the usual Lyrica,gabapenten etc. Interferon injection? Baclofen has been mentioned before but has pretty nasty side effects if you were to try to work on it. Choochoo and many others are all about the testosterone theory and I truly agree. Vas lowers T and fires up other issues.
I find it interesting they say a vasectomy doesn’t cause other issues given there hasn’t been a study in 20 years and the study was done incredibly poorly.
You can’t have a study with shitty questions.
The reference in that article is the natural dip in T most men experience at that age. I do find the link very interesting. Anyone who thinks hormones don’t change post vas are ignorant. Bodies work by feedback loops. There are plenty of articles documenting the change in hormones post vas. However, most men don’t feel it. Therefore it’s deemed insignificant. I think the stress from the pain that some have experience is what caused the hormones to tumble to symptomatic levels. Another thing that almost no one talks about is the seminal changes. The vas is fluid filled, it’s not a dry tube. Proteins come from the seminal vesicles meaning the vas is full of hormones before it gets to that point. We absorb some of those around the prostate. At the same time, when you ejaculate, your girl gets a lot of those hormones in addition to the sperm. That’s good for her too. Now she gets nothing but protein. Her T drops as well as a result.
Baclofen does not really have nasty of side effects mentally. It can make your muscles a little weak but if you work out you can counter it. It’s not something you take for nerve pain with MS but for muscle spasms caused by MS. It’s not neuro-protective or AI regulating at all. It just turns off spasms.
As far as vasectomies causing hormone levels to drop I’ve seen many, many doctors on the web saying this is true. They usually are not citing research but noting that they see it “a lot” and it’s one of the first questions they ask when I guy comes in and turns out to have low T. I think I noticed that many of these guys are pro replacement therapy so they of course will have an agenda too but I have read that in multiple places - doctors saying that vasectomies can cause test levels to be lower.
My last set of numbers were pretty horrid and my sex drive lately is pretty indicative of that. I did have sex with my wife last Saturday afternoon though when we suddenly found the kids were out of the house and we had some time to kill.
The research is there. Print it off and take to your doc. Makes for an interesting conversation. I’ve educated myself enough that most doctors now concede they don’t have any clue how to help. But…that takes some serious back and forth to get the admission. This is a complex problem that involves the nervous system. Something the world doesn’t understand very well.
I’ll never convince my GP to give t if levels are in normal range. He just won’t. He would give baclofin but only if neurologist says ok.
I’m going for Denervation on left . If it helps fantastic but I do have a neuro appointment set up if this doesn’t help at all . He may have some better med knowledge and ideas than pain guys I’ve seen. They have a list they use and don’t try anything different.
What are your levels? If it’s under 400 total or less than 6 free, I’d find another doc.
Range here is 10.2 to 29.5 and I’m at 16.3. My whole system is so messed up its scary. Head ringing, legs hurting, groin pain is nasty, can’t sleep worth a shit . Good thing ibuprofen makes me tired and helps pain some. 800 before bed.
I wouldn’t quit pushing until you got to try levels above 25 for at least a month. Why the hell not. Surely it can’t be worse for you than all the others. What if it’s the fix? Docs refuse to touch hormones yet dive into the scrotum with a hot knife. Ignorance!
You are so right but I can not get educated help here. My Gp doesn’t want to give t because it might evoke prostate Cancer. I’m experiencing Cancer like pain right now wtf is the difference. No harm in jumping t to 25. Why the hell not? Is right. Wouldn’t that be something.
I was 397 total and 7 free in the last tests I got.
The highest I have been post vas and reversal for total was around 465 maybe? I’d have to look.
The lower end of the reference range is 348 and 6.8 total and free.
This is from a guy with low libido, energy and brain fog. I told my wife well I’m normal. .for an 85 year old man.
@MikeO how old are you? Our numbers are about the same. I’m 378 with 4.0 free testosterone.
I will be 50 in 1 month.
I got snipped at 41.
I can’t believe I’ve been dealing with this for so long. Life keeps going. It doesn’t stop and wait for you to feel good.
@MikeO I’m 33. Those numbers are too low for both of us. Where are you located? My only recommendation would be to try when of those all male sex clinics. They tend to be more open minded about raising T levels to improve quality of life. Everyone else drinks the koolaid.
I’m in the US.
My main problem is the pain is getting where I want to quit my job. It’s like a knife stabbing me in the seat. I will start the week quasi ok then by Wednesday it will be getting bad. Last Friday I sent my wife some really awful texts. I was at the pharmacy and I was in a hurry be a use my kid had an event I needed to get to. Something that should have been happy. They messed it up and suddenly I realized I wouldn’t even have to deal with it of it were not for the vas. Then I thought off all the years of pain and inconvenience and I got really really mad. I should not have even been in that damn line, in pain. This may sound crazy bit I’m still not sure exactly where it’s coming from. I know sitting makes it worse.
@MikeO I understand exactly how you feel. I was at the top of my career when this all went down. I’ve spent over $1 million and 10 years on my education/business. I can barely get myself out of bed to get to work. I have an amazing support system at home which makes it even more difficult to consider stepping out of the work force as I’m the sole provider. I’m completely trapped and there doesn’t appear to be anyway out. Can’t imagine how I’m supposed to practice another 30 years like this. People see me and say, “oh he looks fine.” Without realizing I was contemplating suicide earlier that day. The up and down emotions are the most mentally challenging thing I’ve done. Without my wife and children I’m not sure I’d be around.
The whole lack of outward signs of damage or injury thing drives me crazy. Especially with doctors. “oh well it looks fine” … yeah but it doesn’t feel fine.
Hopefully you don’t decide to go there. I’ve been hospitalized for thoughts like that and trust me - get help if the feelings get too real or you can’t get your mind off it. I had quite the adjustment period “getting used” to PVPS and one thing that helped was a pain psychologist. Didn’t help at all with the pain but it was someone I could talk to and after I explained what was going on and showed how guys are more or less mislead about the risks he got it. I used to go pretty often now it’s like once a month.
I hear you on the family thing. I spend my days just trying to get by and get home.
Fortunately those thoughts aren’t what they used to be. 2 months out I remember being released from the ER and I was ready. Darkest place I’ve ever been. My determination to get better and find answers has helped more than anything. The answer is out there somewhere.
Hang in there. I have those dark thoughts everyday. It’s like a back up plan. Love my folks and daughters so I keep dealing with it. If I end up on street because I can’t work with this pain that will be it. After this procedure I’m trying everything. Physio,massage, bath, steam room,max ibuprofen,cymbalta,continue my vitimin smoothies, treadmill,etc. If this doesn’t help I’m in big trouble. It truly is similar to trying to beat ms. I told urologist this is a disease all on its own. He agreed and also told me something interesting. He came out and said "I do vasectomies but would never get it done and am open and tell men Id never get it done. He said 15% of guys have problems. He has seen many like us. Good guy. Easy to communicate with, open and skilled.I hope skilled lol.